Ambassador: Exposing UN Waste & Trump’s Pro Gay Policies | Richard Grenell | POLITICS | Rubin Report

Ambassador: Exposing UN Waste & Trump’s Pro Gay Policies | Richard Grenell | POLITICS | Rubin Report


– It’s challenging
to go to the UN and participate in the
system where the UN says we have this formula,
and every country gets to have a certain amount of
people get jobs at the UN. So they look at the
formula and they say, oh, well, how many people
do we have from Nigeria? Oh, we need more. Go hire people into the
system from Nigeria. It tends to not be whether
or not someone is qualified or has the skill set, it is, are we being
fair and equal on the disbursement of jobs? – We’re hearing a lot
of this idea lately. All over the place.
– Right. And that’s where it breaks down. Because you’re hiring people
that really don’t know what they’re doing,
and they waste money, and the UN becomes
a jobs program. (upbeat music) – Hey, I’m Dave Rubin, and
this is “The Rubin Report”. As always, guys, make
sure you subscribe to our YouTube channel and
click that notification bell so that you have a small chance of actually seeing our
videos in your feed, and more importantly,
joining me today is the former US
spokesman at the UN, and currently the American
ambassador to Germany. Rick Grenell, welcome
to “The Rubin Report”. – Pretty amazing. This is really cool.
– Pretty amazing, this is really cool. I gotta tell ya, I thought,
and my team thought, we’re bringing in
our first ambassador. The ambassador to Germany. Big country, important
powerful guy. We thought you were
gonna be in a sharp suit, you’d bring us German
chocolates and treats, things like that. I have never had a more
casual guest in this studio, Mr. Ambassador.
– I would say that this is because of you, right?
– (laughs) Yeah. – Because I figured I’m
in a suit all the time. But if Dave is
gonna interview me, I better be pretty casual. I know your crowd
is pretty casual. – My crowd is casual. I feel like I should be wearing, I have that same UGG hoodie. I could be, should
we stop right now? – But do you have
the same T-shirt? – I don’t have the
gay mustache T-shirt. – Available at Target.
– Is that a Target? – Yeah, it’s Target.
– You truly are a man of the people.
– Yeah. – All right, we got
a lot to talk about. So I realized yesterday when
I was doing a little research on ya, ’cause that’s what I do– – Don’t believe it,
don’t believe it. – That even though,
right, everything they say about you must be true, right? I’m pretty sure that’s how it
works online and Wikipedia. They’re not messing
with it or anything. – Right.
– But even though we’ve been friends for
a couple years now and I know you pretty
well, I realized that I actually don’t know
anything about your life, like, childhood or anything. I don’t even know
where you’re from. And then I started doing
some reading and I was like, nah, let’s pick it up here, ’cause you’re the
ambassador of Germany. Where the hell are you from? How did this whole thing happen? – I was born in
Muskegon, Michigan. I’m the youngest of four kids, and so my parents
moved to California in Redwood City, actually. And so I went to elementary
school in Redwood City, moved back to Michigan
in seventh grade. So I went to junior
high and high school all in Jenison, Michigan. And then I went, my
parents are Evangelical, which I know you know. I grew up Evangelical and I went to Evangel College,
which is the national liberal arts school for the Assemblies of
God Evangelical movement. Great school, had an
amazing experience. Small, it’s in
Springfield, Missouri. And then worked on Capitol
Hill for a little while. Worked on presidential
campaign of ’92, and then went to
the Kennedy School and got a Masters at
the Kennedy School and then kinda kept
doing political stuff. – Were you always into
politics as a kid? – Yes, which is crazy. I loved the media, I loved
watching the news with my dad. And we’d sit down together
and watch the news and talk about these issues. My dad was pretty
political in a sense that he liked to
talk about politics and would always be involved in the local congressional
race of supporting somebody, basically, and
stuffing envelopes. And so he gave me that
kind of excitement. I like the pure competition
of it in many ways. I’m a very competitive person. There’s nothing like
having two campaigns that are jostling, and then
there’s an election day, right, there’s
like a finish line. There’s a day that everybody
votes, who did it better? And who do I like? And that pure competition–
– Well, that all depends on what the Russians decide.
– That’s true, that’s true. But I like that
whole competition
thing about politics. And I think a lot
of people go into it because of the pure fun and
political competition of it. I also am geeky and
care about policy. And I love to dig deep on
policy and make change, make the world a better place.
– Does it shock you the amount of people
that are in politics that are endlessly miserable
related to politics? Like, I see so much of that now, where it’s like, these
people who think that all of their life and their
whole salvation is politics. It’s like, it only can
lead you to disaster or depression somehow. Where if you have a
certain different look where it’s not everything,
it’s not everything, then you can kinda have
a smile on your face when you talk about it. – I think that it’s largely
if you live in Washington DC. I mean, it’s an incestuous
town of people who, on both sides of the
aisle their kids go to the same school, and
they go to the same church, and so they protect each other and they live in Washington
and they just kind of flip. When it’s the Obama
Administration, all my democrats
friends are connected and they include me in the
local dining experience and social circles, and then when my guy
is in and they’re out, I’ll take care of them, and
lobbyists are all there, and the whole city is growing. It’s such a terrible place. The real world outside
of Washington, DC, I think gives you perspective. And so I have worked
in the political realm for, like, more than 25 years. I’ve only lived in
Washington from 1993 to 1995. I got out, I can’t
stand going back. And I think that
gives you perspective. It’s not unlike here, in
LA, where we both live. If you’re a part of Hollywood, and you’re working at a studio and all you live and
breathe is the blogs, and the TV, media,
Hollywood stuff, you don’t get a very
good perspective. It’s the actors who
move to Atlanta, or who move their production
companies to Chicago or Montana who I think
have better perspective and they do better
work ’cause they have just a different view.
– How has, then, being in Germany, living in
Germany as our Ambassador in Germany changed your
perspective on American politics when you see it from,
not just living in DC, but actually living abroad?
– Yeah. So I actually asked for the job
to be Ambassador of Germany. And one of the reasons why
is my eight years at the UN taught me this kind of lesson. If you’ve ever been
to the UN and you walk into that huge
general assembly hall, 193 placards looking at you, it feels like the super friends,
the hall of super friends. – I took the tour when I
was in, like, ninth grade. That’s the only
time I was there. – Yeah, it does feel like
the hall of super friends. But as an American–
– It’s more like the legion of doom, though.
– Yeah, for sure. When you walk in that hall
and you see 193 countries, as an American, you quickly say, where are my European friends? Because we view the
world the same way when it comes to democracy,
rule of law, human rights. You’re not trying to
convince European countries that they shouldn’t shove a
gay person off a building. We have the relatively
the same perspective. And so I found that in
my eight years at the UN in dealing with the Europeans, we tend to, as
Americans, negotiate with what we call the E3, the British, the
French, and the Germans. Our experience with
the E3 became that the Germans were the
weakest of the E3. They were dragging down our
negotiations with the Europeans. – Can you give me an
example of how they would do that sort of thing?
– So I’ll give you a recent example. I would say when the
UN finally came around and gave a second report
that Bashar al-Assad had gassed children
and gassed people. And we, the West, the
Western Alliance wanted to respond to that. The Americans
approached the British and they said, “We’re in”. We approached the French and
they said, “What do you need?” We approached the
Germans and they said, “We don’t like war,
we’re against war.” We’ve had this special history and so we really don’t want
to participate in war anymore. And so I’ve actually
said to Chancellor Merkel and to the Foreign Minister, and to lots of
people of Germany, that’s the wrong
lesson of World War II. The lesson of World War
II for the Germans is that they should
be the first ones to recognize a madman
who’s gassing children, and that they should be
in the front of the bus. And they should say,
let’s form a collate. Now, I get that because
of their special history, they don’t wanna do
it alone anymore. And so they literally want to be surrounded by
multi-lateralism. Great. But you had that
with the French, the British, and the Americans. And they still
couldn’t participate. So I think we’re in a
slide over the last years, and one of the things
I wanted to solve was this Germany
first economic model, but Germany wanting to have
a Switzerland foreign policy where they’re gonna be
friends with everybody and just cash in. I mean, Germany is
really the first country in terms of the economics to
be a Germany first policy. And America first
is only coming along a little while later,
but the Germans have been doing it for awhile. – So that’s a pretty
big split, sort of, if Germany is going,
Germany first economically, but then on the world stage, we kinda gotta dip out,
’cause of our history. Did Merkel respond to
you in a positive way when you said that
maybe we should be more, we, you should be more involved? – Look, I think the
Chancellor does have an innate good reaction
to say we should do more and we should participate, and we should pay our NATO
bills even though they’re not, and try to get to
that spending– – [Dave] Yeah, I wanna talk
about that, by the way. – I do think that she thinks
that that’s important, but that it’s a lofty goal
because they really want to bring the public along first, and no politician
in Germany wants to step out and be a leader. Now, remember the German
word for leader is fuhrer, which is too close to the word
that they used for Hitler. And so many times, talking
about being a leader conjures up really
negative stereotypes. And so try being the US
Ambassador to Germany, asking the Germans to do more
without using the word leader. How do you say, you
can’t say be a leader. You have to say, step
out and what do you say? You can’t even say,
lead by example. – Do you think there is,
like, an actual sort of psychological condition, then,
that they will ever be able to get out of? Do you think it’s
just, like, so embedded in the ethos of what it
means to be German now, because of the history? – I mean, first of all,
let’s just say what it is, it’s pretty serious. It’s an incredible
monumental stain that lasts through generations. And I’ll tell you
one of the things, the dynamics that we’ve
experienced in Germany is that there are now
young people who are trying to be tech entrepreneurs
or run businesses. And you hear little whisper
campaigns of to say, oh, they have their
money or their house because they were
sympathizers with the Nazis. Or they didn’t stand
up against the Nazis. So there is still this
very societal competition of finger pointing, who
was good, and who was bad? And imagine if we had to
talk about our grandparents as whether or not they stood up, or whether or not
they took cover and they tried to do
what they had to do. Pretty incredible
kind of monumental
things to think about. And so I would say one
of the things that I see is we, as the Westerners,
when we hear never again, we all think never
again means never again will you slaughter people
and get to the point where your hatred becomes the
systematic killing, right? Never again, for many
Germans, means never again are we gonna have
any military role. They don’t necessarily
believe that never again means you can have a working military that defends your country
and participates in good around the world, and
never again just means don’t let it get out of hand. But for them, in many ways,
never again just means no military
operations whatsoever. – God, I mean, we could
do show upon show of that. I’m sure in Germany they’re
doing that all the time and trying to work through that. – You’d be surprised, the German
media is pretty groupthink. Not many step out.
– Well, I told you last night about my experience
with the German media. – (laughs) Oh, yeah.
– They called me– – I could have solved
that for you so easy if you would have
just said to me, I got a call from a
“Speigel” reporter, I would have said,
Dave, hang up now. I mean, come on,
they’ve made up stories about Americans constantly,
they got caught making stories. – They got caught, yeah.
– And then they took ’em a year to kind of admit it. And the whole time
they’re saying, oh we have the
best fact-checking
system in the world. They couldn’t fact check
to save their life. It was like–
– Just for the people that don’t remember,
they put a picture of me on the cover of
the magazine saying I’m the grand illusionist
of the Alt Right. And you can see my big
American flag over there, and I was sitting in front of
the American flag like this, and it looks like I’m some,
like, Alt Right leader. And they’re talking about
my Scandinavian furniture, which is IKEA, and my
fancy Italian coffeemaker, which is Nespresso, I
mean, the whole thing. All right, anyways, side bar. Let’s go back–
– I could have saved you that pain.
– I know. I mean, how did I not call you? – Yeah, I don’t know.
– God, I’m an idiot. All right, well, let’s
back up for a second, because you mentioned your
Evangelical upbringing, and then you showed me your
gay mustache shirt, Rick. I thought, “This
is not possible.” I thought Evangelicals
can’t be gay, or Christian theology and
homosexuality are at odds, or all of these things,
yet you strike me as a decent functioning person, and we’ve had dinner
with you and Matt and all that good stuff. So make some sense out of this. – You know, I think being gay
makes me a better Christian, to be honest. I’ll tell you this. I have felt guilty, and
this is an admission, that when I had cancer and
I was really kind of down in terms of my physical outlook, I felt like I prayed more
and I was closer to God because I was in need, right? I feel guilty about that
as I go through life and of course the
ups and downs of life when things are going well,
you don’t pray as much. You don’t really think about God or the existence of the Creator. And I started to feel
really guilty about that. And so I just think
that every person needs to have, whether it’s
a group of people, or a philosophy of some sort
that keeps ’em in check. That kind of questions
what life’s ups are about. And so for me being gay, I
think I get so much challenge that you can’t be gay
and be a Christian, that it makes me a
better Christian. I’m an imperfect
follower of Christ. I fail every single day. But for me, what’s the
beauty of this is that the Bible talks about having
new mercies every morning and grace every morning. I get up every morning
and I just think, “Thank God that I
believe in the Creator, “and that every morning
I have a new beginning “and a new chance
to prove myself “in this totally human
state that fails every day.” And so, I was made
this way, right? And the Bible says,
“Everyone is fearfully “and wonderfully made.” I was made this
way, I was born gay. So the fact of the matter
is is that I fully embrace the fact that I was made
this way in the image of God, and you can be gay
and be a Christian, and there’s no problem with it. I think the world is also
changing within the church, that the church
really believes that, and when you look at
the biblical kind of
mantra about this, you really have to go back
to the original language, the original Greek
and really understand what the words were
when the translation in the 1950s somehow takes
the word homosexuality and puts it into a
different context. I don’t know if you
know Peter Gomes. He passed away, but–
– No. – Peter was the minister
at Harvard Memorial Church. And he was conservative, and
black, and gay, and a minister. And he was an incredible, just literally an
incredible mentor to me to think about
how God made me and what the Bible says
about really a whole bunch of these kind of
20th century issues. The subjugation of women,
immigration, all these. He wrote this book
called “The Good Book”, and he takes all these
issues and goes back to show how both sides of
the argument over the years have used the Bible
in their favor. They’ve said things
like God has told me to have this position. And you manipulate
it on both sides. And he kind of showed, look, stop with the
manipulators and look at what the original
language says. I love things like that. It’s like an exogenesis
of the words and the time. – Yeah, if you think that
something particularly good or interesting is happening with the evangelical
community, generally, I was telling you last night, I mean, I spoke at
Liberty University in front of 14,000 people,
they know that I’m gay. I didn’t sense that
one person cared in some sort of negative sense. I walked around campus,
everybody was incredibly nice. The amount of emails that
I get from evangelicals in the middle of
country who, actually, most of them say, they
usually say they don’t care that I’m gay, or they
don’t even know, often. And they’ll say, I was
watching you for two years until I even found out. And it’s like, I
don’t even care. Which is sort of how
you want it to be. – Then, like, all of the sudden do the shirt, announce it.
– And now you’ve really blown my cover here with
your gay mustache shirt. But do you sense that
something has shifted with evangelicals where maybe during the George W.
Bush re-election year where they made gay
marriage such a wedge issue, and suddenly evangelicals
were not behaving, maybe, Christ-like, or however
you wanna put it. – So I think there’s
two issues in there that I would confront. One on the political side, yes. It’s completely changing. I went to the 1992
convention in Houston, and I’ve been to every
convention since then. And let me tell you,
the 1992 convention, when speeches got up there
and were very anti-gay, it’s much different.
– So this is, that was Bob Dole? – No, that was
Bush/Quail re-election. – Oh, okay, okay, yeah.
– And so, we’ve made dramatic changes. Every four years, I
can see the convention and the political process
completely changing. But let’s also
talk about the fact my brother is a very well-known
evangelical minister. I’ve got nephews who
are evangelical pastors, and so I know this
crowd really well. And I think there’s a difference between the political
nature of the issues by them embracing things like
the decriminalization
of homosexuality around the world. They don’t think countries
should arrest someone for being gay, or kill
someone for being gay. Evangelicals believe that. They say, no, no, no,
you shouldn’t do that. It’s quite different,
though, to say, are you gonna jump up
and down and be happy that two men are
getting married, and
do you approve that? I don’t necessarily need the
answer to the second question. – Yeah, I don’t, either.
– I don’t go around and approve the marriages
of people in my own family– – (laughs) Right.
– Or people that come into my life, I don’t
sit there and say, I don’t know if
this should work. I don’t agree with this.
– Right, we know plenty of straight couples like that, but I don’t wander around
all day worrying about it or–
– Or if you did bring it up every single time
you were around ’em, you probably wouldn’t have
a very good friendship if, when you were at dinner
with them to say, like, I don’t get
how this works. Like, you’re an accomplished
person and you’re a slouch. (Dave laughing)
You just don’t say things like that,
and we don’t judge other people’s
marriages, so to speak. And so that’s worked with me. I just say to people,
I don’t need applause. I don’t need you
to jump up and down and scream happiness
that I am gay. I just want to be equal. And so I think
there is an element, I hate to say it like this
’cause this is way too simple. But it is an agree to disagree. – Well, as long as
the rights are equal, I’m fine.
– Correct. – You can think
whatever you want. I mean, this is,
people get pissed because I’m friends
with Ben Shapiro. And it’s like, he has his
orthodox Jewish perspective on gay marriage. He’s not trying to stop
me from being married. He may not be
thrilled personally that I’m married, or have
his own religious belief attached to it–
– But he’s not denying you your rights.
– Yeah, so what do I expect in this world, do
you know what I mean? Or what do I expect
from this country, in a free country? – I went to the 1993
March on Washington for, when Bill Clinton and
Al Gore had taken over. And that march was incredible because I’m gonna
get the number wrong and somebody’s gonna come at me. – Oh, back on that, yeah.
– Yeah, I think it was, like, a million people, right? Gays, and lesbians,
and straight supporters all came out to
Washington and marched. And it was dramatic
in that I think it was at that point that
things became political on gays and lesbians
and the LGBT movement. Before then, we kind of
all were on the outs. And so we were together
when Washington people, Republicans and Democrats
were not making this the wedge issue. But I will say that
the march on Washington left our community
with a sense of, we just want equality. And if you go back
to that march, Dave, the mantra was
tolerance and diversity. We recognized that other
people were not going to agree with us, and
our whole request, our ask was just
embrace diversity. We know you don’t
agree with everything that we stand for, but let’s just be
tolerant of each other. Remember, hate is not a family
value was this whole thing. Now, the entire leadership
of the LGBT movement in Washington, DC is
all about cancel culture and absolutely pushing
people out of the argument to say, I don’t even
wanna be friends with you if you voted for Trump or
you’re a gay conservative. I can’t even fathom
being friends with you. – Well, now they also wanna
take your gayness away, right? So they’ll write articles,
that famous article in “Out Magazine” about how
Peter Thiel is not gay– – Enough.
– Because it’s not who you have sex with or who
you love that makes you gay, it’s actually a
political way of thinking that makes you gay,
which is psychotic. – Which is why GLAAD has this
whole, like, immigration. And it’s a movement
beyond anything that has to do with gays and lesbians. And I think they’re
trying to survive, right? – Well, it’s not just the
cops need a certain amount of crime type of thing. It’s like, we got equal rights. And not to say everything is
perfect and there are some– – Right, but I work around
the world and let me tell ya, people around the world who
are fighting for equality, and I really mean this,
they are totally annoyed at the New York, Hollywood,
West Hollywood gays who raise a lot of money
for black tie events and aren’t doing a thing to help our brothers and
sisters in Lebanon who are getting arrested, or
look what happened in Zambia, they literally prosecuted
two guys for being gay and the court said,
“Oh, no we’re doing this “because they’re gay.” They didn’t make up
some pedophilia thing. – No, no, but if you
say something about that you’re somehow racist, right? Or you’re a xenophobe
or something like that because you’re
pushing your values. But some values are
better than others. That must be the
number one thing you have to fight
all the time, right? At the UN, or over
the years at the UN that you had to fight
that now as Ambassador. – Well, I’m now
fighting this thing at the State Department where, when it comes to the
decriminalization campaign. – So you’re spearheading
this thing, right? – I’m spearheading this thing. There’s 69 countries that
criminalized homosexuality. 10 will kill you for being gay, and we’ve launched a process,
we’ve done a whole bunch. We’re trying to stay
out of the media in terms of telling
them every little thing because the media’s
pretty hostile to something like this. We’re making great progress.
– The media is pretty hostile to something like
decriminalizing– – From the Trump Administration. – Right, yeah.
– Honestly. – I know, well,
we’ll get to that. I was about to tell you a
second ago that we’ve talked for about a half hour or so, and until about a minute ago, the T-word had not come up
yet, which I think is a record. – Yeah.
– But so we’ll get to that in a second,
but sorry, go ahead. – But the
de-criminalization campaign, we’re making so much progress. Granted this is gonna
be a long fight, trying to convince 69 countries to do a change in domestic laws to not criminalize
homosexuality. And that’s all
this is is step one is just to work on
criminalization. Others are working on
step two through 20. I felt the need to do step one because when I look
around the world, step one wasn’t
really being pushed. I’d been working with,
now this is gonna be bad ’cause they’re probably
gonna go after them, but I’ve been working
with Stuart Milk of the Harvey Milk
Foundation, who’s fantastic, who’s totally focused
on this problem. And so what we’re
trying to do is to have 69 different
campaigns, basically, ’cause you’ve gotta work
with the local community. Remarkable stories
that I could just go in over and over that I don’t
because I don’t wanna highlight it and
scare people away that are working
in these countries, but suffice to say
this was a fight that needed to happen
that was not happening. And right now, I have to
face, at the state department, resistance from people
who don’t want Americans or Westerners to go
into other countries and take a stand for the
decriminalization campaign, because literally there
are countries that believe that the West and
specifically America have imported into their
country, being gay. And so they’re like, oh
no, no American should talk about this ’cause
you’re gonna emphasize. My position back is
that’s the stupidest idea that Americans
brought in the gay. – Right.
– I’m not– – There were gay
people before America. It’s only about 200-year thing. – Right, so I’m not gonna
actually be silent on that and participate in
letting them silence me because they’ve got some
crazy conspiracy theory. I’m gonna bust the
conspiracy theory wide open and say you’re wrong.
– How do you decide, though, when to
use extra pressure to get a country
to do something? Because I know generally
as a conservative and from what I know about you, you don’t love the idea of
telling countries what to do. Like, it’s not really, like,
in the conservative ethos. – Right.
– And yet I understand, you want people to be free. So how do you decide when we
can apply more pressure, or– – Such a good question.
– Yeah. I get one, I get
one every interview. That’s the one.
– I would say that I have this philosophy
that as a diplomat, I am working at the
State Department, and I have to be successful
in order to avoid war. Because if you have diplomats
who are not successful, that file of a problem
gets transferred over to the Pentagon, and
they don’t negotiate. They just solve the problem. And so I firmly believe
that diplomats should be at the forefront of
pushing and prodding and demanding talks and
demanding that we have a table to air
our grievances on. Like, if we’re planning to bomb, if DoD is ready to
attack, I would hope that we have brave
diplomats that are saying, wait a minute, I
got one more chance, let’s sit down, let’s
try the diplomacy thing. So I get hit constantly for,
oh, you’re undiplomatic, or you’re too tough. And I thought, “That’s what
you want in a diplomat.” ‘Cause you wanna have
somebody that’s working hard to avoid war through talk, through pushing and prodding, rather than transferring
the file over and having a problem solved
through military action. – Has some of that been
tough for you, though? Because you used to
fight on Twitter more, or be more of, like,
a battler there, where you’re an Ambassador now, you’re a guy in a hoodie. You’ve calmed it
down a little bit. – I still think that
I pick my fights. I don’t feel like
I’ve backed off. What I do think is
that I wanna make sure that someone is in that fight, and so I look to see,
like on a media bias issue I still get really charged up if the groupthink in Washington, or the political
circles is one way and nobody’s challenging that, I’m willing to jump in. I don’t care if I have
the title of Ambassador, I’m still gonna jump
in and try to push and correct the record
where I see fit. If others are doing it,
and thank God you’re in there to do it,
then sometimes I can– – A little ground support.
– Yeah, I can let it go and look for the next problem. – Yeah, can you talk
a little bit about just generally what
the state of the UN is, and what it was
like to be there? And you know that
so many people think that it’s like this
sort of perfect thing that the countries come together and figure out what’s
right for everybody. Like, they love the
idea of it more than, I think, functionally how
it works or does not work. – Well, first of all, the, I always try to
correct people that the UN doesn’t really exist. The UN is member states, right? So when somebody says,
oh the UN says no. I always say, the
UN doesn’t say no. Members at the UN, maybe
Russia and China got together and the Security
Council and said no, but the UN doesn’t
take a position. And so I try to not
just reflexively blame, oh, the UN’s stopped something, ’cause it’s really
member countries,
that’s the first thing. The second thing is,
is the UN does not work unless the US is leading it. Whether it’s the
World Food Program, UNICEF, UNDP, the
development programs, whatever it is, the
US has to be there, otherwise the UN does not work. The UN system is based on
every country is equal, not every person is
equal, it’s every country. And that’s where I
think, as Americans, we say, that’s just
fundamentally not true. Every country is not equal. So in the general
assembly, when we pretend that these small
island countries get the same vote as China,
or the United States, or the bigger economies, that’s kind of
laughable to be honest. I get that we wanna
have a general assembly where people have
the ability to talk, but I don’t love the idea
of one country, one vote, which I think is balanced
by the Security Council and the idea that the
substantive work goes to the Security Council. So I get the kind of separation. But it’s challenging
to go to the UN and participate in a
system where the UN says we have this formula,
and every country gets to have a certain amount of
people get jobs at the UN. So they look at the
formula and they say, oh, well, how many people
do we have from Nigeria, oh we need more, go hire people into the system from Nigeria. It tends to not be whether
or not someone is qualified or has the skillset, it is, are we being fair and equal
on the disbursement of jobs? – We’re hearing a lot
of this idea lately, all over the place.
– Right. And that’s where it breaks down, ’cause you’re hiring people
that really don’t know what they’re doing
and they waste money and the UN becomes
a jobs program. – Is the UN better
at certain things and worse at others? So like, when it comes
to food disbursement or helping development,
that kind of stuff it seems like they’re
probably pretty decent at, and then the Security Council, or a lot of the rest
of it seems like 90% of it is just
voting against Israel– – Yeah, for sure.
– Moving a rock. – Yeah, I think you hit
it on the head is that we pay 25% of the UN bill. And that’s for the
Secretariat and for the, kind of, UN Administration.
– And all the parking tickets, right?
(Rick laughing) Isn’t the whole thing
just parking tickets? – Exactly.
– Isn’t that what they say? Just Ambassadors–
– You get to park wherever you want.
– Yeah. – But at the same
time, there are these what they call extra
bodies, independent bodies. And those are funded through
voluntary contributions. So World Food
Program and UNICEF, they don’t get monies
from the general fund of the 25% money that we give. UNICEF only gets its
budget by appealing to people to say
we’ve got a crisis. We need to go out, and who
wants to write us a check? The Europeans, the
Germans, the Americans? We fund the most on
those World Food Program, UNICEF type independent bodies. That’s why they’re well-run, it’s because we demand
management, transparency, and accountability, in
these independent bodies. We don’t have that ability to do in the UN General Assembly. So you get this kind of
really blob-type management and mission from the
actual UN operations. – What is the
obsession with Israel with the General Assembly? I mean, every time you
look at that chart, it’s like 90% of the
condemnations and actions. – Well, you know,
there’s only one country that can’t serve on the Security
Council and that’s Israel. I’m outraged by it. I’m telling you, I think that
the US government should just put its foot down and say
we’re gonna clear the deck and Israel should be
on the Security Council just to prove a
point of getting them on the Security Council. There’s this fascination
with condemning Israel. It’s why we got out of
the Human Rights Council is because you’ve got
nine resolutions on Israel and nothing on Iran, or,
I mean, the word is out. If you don’t wanna be
condemned by the UN, and you’re a human
rights abuser, then go run for the
Human Rights Council so you can protect yourself.
– Right. Trump somehow just
gets all this? Like, he really has
fixed a lot of this or is in the process
of fixing it, or– – He’s not of the
political establishment. And so he’s willing
to be a disrupter. We all know about
disruptive technology and people who go
in and say, gosh, everybody has a groupthink
and you’re missing the big reform effort. I think Americans
really want Washington to be disrupted, or the UN. They look at it and
say, what a waste. Why are we spending
all that money? But the system in Washington
filled with lobbyists and all the people that
take care of each other, they don’t want an
outsider coming in and somehow wrecking their
good fortune, you know? And we see that in Hollywood. We see that same
thing in Hollywood. And so I want to applaud
and do everything I can for President Trump
because first of all, he’s got really thick skin. All of the people who just
constantly come at him. Thank God we got a
president who’s just really tough on that
and doesn’t care. And two, he sees
it for what it is and he’s not really
that partisan. I mean, I look at what
I’m starting to call the Trump doctrine,
which I think, the Trump doctrine
to foreign policy, which is a dual approach
to every single issue, where you use every tool
of the US government. Economic, dual
sanctions, pressure to change the
behavior of a country. And you really utilize that
pressure in a strong way. At the same time, there’s
this separate path to say, let’s talk, let’s sit down
and have a diplomatic talk. He’s doing it with Kim Jong Un. And the Neocons and the
traditional Republicans did not like him
saying, I’m gonna just go talk to Kim Jong Un. They only wanna
do the squeezing. They don’t always
wanna say, well, why not talk to see
if we can test this? Talking is a tactic. It’s not the goal. – So when you see, then, like, the never Trump conservatives, so like the Bill Crystals,
or just those guys that have sort of
been around forever and usually you’ve gotten
everything wrong always, are they different privately? Like, are they privately
kinda like, yeah, I like what he’s doing,
and he’s even more– – I don’t think so. I think they’re
creatures of Washington. I think they live
in Washington, DC and they want people
to play by the rules. The people who
benefit from the rules and they want everybody to
come in and play by the rules are on both sides of the aisle. This is not a
partisan thing at all. It’s you gotta come to our
city and play by our rules because we got lobbyists
to take care of, and we got a system, and
everybody is participating in the system. Marco Rubio actually talked
about this just the other day, and I thought it
was really good. He was saying, look,
when I came to Washington and I didn’t go to
their cocktail parties, I eventually didn’t get invited
to their cocktail parties and then they
started sniping at me because I wasn’t going
to their cocktail parties and they recognized that I
wasn’t playing by their rules. And he said, “Trump
has done it tenfold.” He’s come in and completely
doubled down on that. And I think it’s right. I think we’re getting senators. Ron Johnson, I think is
another great senator who doesn’t play that game, and he comes from Wisconsin
and plays a different tune, which is, I’m fighting for
the people of Wisconsin. Marco Rubio, I
think is doing that. We have senators that
are beginning to do that and challenge the system. And I think it’s
what the people want. – So what’s it like when
Trump, Donald Trump, New York businessman Donald
Trump, guy becomes President. Then assume your
phone rings one day and he says, looking to send
somebody over to Germany. Is it a phone call,
is it an email, does someone else reach
out to your first? How does that all work?
– Well, so I had been in and around the
campaign quite a bit. And so there’s always a
constant conversation. And there’s also, I
think, the question of, like, who’s loyal, right? Who was here before all of
the jobs were available? Who was committed? And I think they saw
that I was very committed in the campaign. And so the conversation,
to me, was, where do you see yourself
in the administration? Or do you wanna join
the administration? And so from the
beginning I just said, some sort of a
foreign policy role. Let’s discuss and then
we had that conversation. And eventually I was like, I
think Germany is a good fit. – Yeah, so let’s
actually back up, ’cause it’s sort of related
to what you just said there. So you, at one point
when Romney was running, you were an advisor
for foreign policy for the campaign, right?
– When Romney was the nominee. – Yeah, when he was the nominee. – Yeah, so what was that? 2012.
– And this is now, it was really only
for a couple weeks, ’cause then some
strange stuff happened, which is so related
to everything else
we’re talking about here, actually, right?
– Yeah, I mean the reality is that it wasn’t a
couple of weeks, because I had been in the
primary doing all this work. So I had been with
him for a long time. They made it official
once he got the nomination with a big title. But I had already been there
and doing all this work, just because I’d worked in
foreign policy for a long time, and as a spokesman,
I know the media, so I know kind of how
to define the issue and what the media are
thinking is the issue, or how they define it. And then being on the inside, understanding where we wanna go, having somebody to help
you get there, right? If the goal is here
and the media are here, how do you educate? And so with the
relationships that I had with many reporters, it
seemed like a natural fit to be on the campaign
as the spokesman. But then as you’re pointing to, I, of course, had been
out for a very long time and had written about, I
had wrote an article called “The Conservative
Case for Gay Marriage” for the fight, when
we were fighting it. And many social
conservatives at the time didn’t like the fact that
Mitt Romney had hired a openly-gay foreign
policy spokesman. And so they came
at me pretty hard and the campaign
pretty hard by saying, this guy is for gay marriage. You’re not. How is this gonna work? – You gotta finish
that story, though. So the story ends
with you stepping down
voluntarily, right? – Yes. So I needed, in that instance, I needed somebody to
say this is irrelevant. This doesn’t matter. He’s our foreign policy
spokesperson and, you know? – So you were looking for
Donald Trump then, actually? – I was. I was looking for somebody
that would define the issues for the conservatives
as, this is my campaign and this is my beliefs
and to make the case. And clearly the campaign
knew that I was gay before they hired me. That shouldn’t
have been a secret. And so I was just
looking for a protection. And once I saw that
this is gonna be a complicated issue
for the campaign, that they don’t know
how they view this, and their reaction
to me was it’s best if you just stay quiet and
not make any waves for awhile, let’s let his blow over. My reaction was, well,
it’s not gonna blow over ’cause I’m gay, and two,
it’s not gonna blow over ’cause it’s a campaign. People like to inflate
issues on campaigns. It’s now in your lap. You’re gonna have to solve this. And what I eventually
saw was that it was too complicated of
an issue for them. They couldn’t detangle it. And they just wanted
me to stay quiet. And as the spokesman,
you can’t stay quiet. You’re the spokesman.
– The quiet spokesman, yeah. – So I consulted with
a couple of my mentors and they just said,
you know what? Just resign and give
them the ability to go do what they want. And so they never replaced
me, actually on that campaign. – So it’s funny, ’cause I
can see you’re being honest, obviously, but also slightly
diplomatic, here right, ’cause you’re not
trying to throw Romney under the bus, I get it. But without maybe speaking
to him specifically, is that thing that
you’re talking about exactly what you’re
describing Washington is? – Yeah, you know–
– Complete inability to grapple with something
straightforward, let the media do
whatever they want, and then all the good
people who are trying to do something real are
the ones that have to resign or get thrown under the
bus, or the rest of it? – Yeah, I mean, I hope I’m
not like that guy that’s like, oh, I’m a purist, and
I’m the best, and– – No, no.
– Everybody should be like me, because that’s
certainly not the case. I think, though, Dave,
that it’s a good question and I would say that the
answer is more I joined this kind of conservative
movement in 1992, and I had been seeing movement. And I’m somebody who the
glass is always half full. And so I always try to make
sure that we’re growing and changing the
party from the inside. And so I think the
answer is I felt like there was change
always happening, that we were on a
right trajectory, and that even being
hired was a great moment. And I’m not the candidate. So I don’t wanna be the story. I really don’t want, I
wanna help the candidate. And so I recognized that I
had pushed as far as I could in that particular situation. And I wrote an article,
I think a week later, saying how I think that
Mitt Romney would be a better president
than Barack Obama, and that I fully endorsed him. So I’m not sure that
I’m being diplomatic as I am being more truthful
about the progress. And maybe, I mean,
some people, I think, could say you’re jaded, right? Because you’ve been
on the inside too much that you weren’t a purist,
and it’s probably true. I’m more of let’s have
small improvements, and as long as we’re
making improvements and the goal is up here,
I can kind of justify why I’m a part of the process. – So Trump, okay, so
just sort of piecing this all together then,
now you have this guy who you don’t have to
walk that tightrope with. – We had 17 candidates
in the primary. And Donald Trump
really just stuck out. And so I was really
excited to work for him. I mean, look, this is a
guy who was very clear in the campaign that he wanted
to treat everybody the same. He really did. And so I liked working
for him because he was challenging us on the
Iraq War implementation and saying I thought it
was a disastrous decision. He was critiquing
Bush, and McCain, and Romney’s positions
on the Iraq War in a Republican primary. Now, everybody around me
had said, oh, he’s done. But that was all the
Washington type people who were playing by the rules. And if you took the rules,
he would have been done. But the primary is
really about the people outside of Washington. And that’s where
I felt like I was reading the situation
better than what they were because my sphere wasn’t
what the Washington crowd was saying about he’s
done and he’s not acting like a Republican. It was what the Republican
base, or the people, and how they were responding to, yeah, that’s an obvious,
the Iraq War management didn’t go well. And so that was an
honest assessment of some people say, touching
the third rail of politics, of saying the things
you’re not supposed to say. And I like that. – But Rick, I don’t understand. Everybody says if you listen
to the mainstream media that everyone in the world, they don’t respect us anymore, and they think he’s a
buffoon, and all these things. Could that possibly not be true? I mean, that’s what “The New
York Times” is telling us. Really, joking aside,
like, what are you seeing? Like, now as an
Ambassador, when you go to all the NATO things, and
all those places you go to, and all the meetings,
do you sense, like, that people suddenly
don’t respect us? They used to respect
us and they don’t, or we’re not the patsy
anymore, perhaps? Or, like, what is
the real temperature? – So I think what
you’re really asking is, does his style work or
does it not work, right? Compared to Barack Obama’s
style, which is much different. I think we should
be honest and say we got two different styles. Absolutely. Washington rule-making
will tell you that Trump’s style does
not work because he doesn’t participate
in what their rules are. But let’s look at that. Let’s look at whether
or not his style works. Because I’ll take this
argument all day long. I don’t wanna be political here, but let’s just talk facts. Barack Obama was wildly
popular in Germany. Wildly popular, they loved him. – Didn’t he give that
speech before, it was before he was president–
– When he was campaigning, yeah.
– When there was still, like a million people
or something crazy. – Yeah, and he maintained
his popularity. People loved him. But he didn’t get any of
his signature programs or policies through,
and I mean that. You look at TTIP, which was
the economic signature program of the Obama Administration. The Germans killed it. They literally led
the fight to kill it. Nord Stream 2, we
said, don’t build it. They went ahead and built it. Jakiw Palij, the Nazi
prison guard living in New York City for 12 years, the US court said,
get him out of here, he lied to us, we want
him back in Germany. The Germans wouldn’t take him. The entire eight years of
the Obama Administration, they asked, will you take
this Nazi prison guard back? They ignored him. Defense spending. We asked in very nice ways, can you raise your
defense spending? We think that you should
be a better NATO member. They largely didn’t do it. And so all of those
issues were solved under the Trump Administration. And so I’ve actually
said to Chancellor Merkel and to the Foreign minister
and to others in Germany, you’re gonna have to deal
with some tough tweets, you’re gonna have to
deal with some pushing and some ribbing,
because the only way that we can read this is
that the Donald Trump style has worked.
– Do you think they secretly like it,
but sort of publicly, I don’t mean Germany
specifically, but generally that
countries and leaders, they have to sort of pretend
that they don’t like Trump, but as they see the US
sort of re-assert itself, and maybe even as he forces
them to pay a little bit more, actually pay their share,
that in a weird way they almost do like it
because it helps give them a little bit of their
sovereignty back? – For sure.
– Or leadership to look for?
– No, that’s 100% for sure. I think the publics
in Europe like to have the ability to have
their sovereignty back. They love, and President
Trump has said this to Chancellor Merkel. I don’t blame you for not
paying your NATO bill– – (laughs) Right.
– And for buying cheap Russian gas, and having
a $69 billion dollar surplus over us, and having a surplus and 50,000 American
troops protecting you. I don’t blame you. Who wouldn’t do that if you
were the Chancellor of Germany? But then he says, but
now it stops here, because you outsmarted
all these other presidents and now I have to
stick up for my people. – So if Trump is
right about all this, that now countries are paying
more and all of these things– – Which he is totally right.
– Yeah, so granted– – Millions, hundreds
of billions. – Right, so suddenly,
countries are starting to pay their share. Is it just what you’re saying, that it was just the way
Washington always worked, or is it just that we
refused to use any influence on countries, like,
that we were just, it was just always
easier to just be like, ah, we’ll pay for everything. You know what I mean?
– I think some of it is our own fault,
and you’re getting at it a little bit.
– Yeah, I guess that’s what I’m asking. That it was just we kept
bringing in people that just were always like,
ah, we’re paying, and why wouldn’t we pay?
– Yeah, and we gotta be nice and oh, they’re pushing back, and we wanna be pro-European, and so let’s just
have a dinner party, and sit–
– Man, these people are having a lot of parties. – Yeah, and sitting
in European capitals and really, we spent, we
have all of these people in European capitals
working at our embassies. Look, I think our
embassies should be mini-commerce sections. I’ve got a whole bunch
of people at the Embassy who are super smart
and very committed to the United States, and
do great public service. But I have come to the
conclusion that having a whole team of people watching the German political system and reporting back to
Washington by writing cables about what’s happening
in the governor’s race, minister, president’s race
in a state in Germany, and all of that stuff. Super interesting, completely
irrelevant in many ways. We can get that information
off the internet after it happens. We don’t need reporting
officers to do that. What we do need are
economic specialists on LNG, liquid natural gas, or economic specialists
on medical devices to help us get US companies
growing in Europe. I think that our embassies
need to be transformed. Less on the political side, less about the
politics of the country that we can get
through the internet. All this was established
before we had the internet, and now we need to
turn these embassies into America first
economic models, just like what
other countries do. We’re the only
country in the world that gets in trouble for
pushing ourself forward. Everybody’s doing
it, but we’re the one that gets in trouble for
saying, oh, how dare you? – Yeah, did you by any
chance read that book that I’ve got right there? Yoram Hazony, “The
Virtue of Nationalism”? – No, I haven’t. – Because his whole
idea is that– – I am reading–
– Which one? – Douglas Murray’s, though.
– Oh, there you go. Well, there’s plenty of his, a couple good Douglas
Murray books over here. But the basic
premise of the book is that strong
nations, that you have to be a strong nation first. So be America first,
be Germany first, be whatever your
country is first. And that’s how you, by
being a strong nation first, then you can create some sort
of international community if that makes sense,
but that really we’re just doing it all back, or we’ve been doing it
backwards for decades, which is we put ourselves
down and thinking that we’re achieving some higher
goal or something, and then we end up
screwing over everybody. – Yeah, I think that
makes a lot of sense. And sometimes you have
to be able to put forward in a pushy way, your
position in order to get things done. And that doesn’t mean that
the relationship is ruined. It just means that
this is a priority. And so you’re gonna
push it harder. I think that’s been one of
the problems that we’ve had, is just this kind of status quo, let’s all, you’re supposed
to say what you want and I’m supposed
to say what I want, and then we kind of
cut the baby in half and we go away and go to lunch. To me, that’s not diplomacy. I mean, we have to be able
to push forward our agenda. By the way, I’ve never,
I’ve been in thousands of diplomatic discussions. Thousands. I’ve never been in one
where the other side doesn’t ask for something and we ask for
something in return. Happens all the time. This is called diplomacy. What do you want? What do I want? It’s this whole thing. And the idea that you’re
asking for something is not a quid-pro-quo. It’s called diplomacy. This is exactly what we do. We show up to a meeting
and we give our agenda of what we’d like you
to do, and what we need, and then you do that. And then we pick and choose. And when you make it a priority, this is what I could
say on the Jakiw Palij, the Nazi prison guard thing. When I showed up in Germany, and I made this a priority, and I said this return
of the Nazi prison guard, I brought it up in
my first meeting with the foreign minister. And you know what the
foreign minister said to me after I brought it up? I’ve never heard of this case. – [Dave] (laughs) I
mean, that’s incredible. – The State Department
had told me, oh, we’ve asked for 12 years. It’s gonna go nowhere, but
you should bring it up. In my Senate confirmation,
I got a written question. “Will you make Jakiw Palij, “the return of the
Nazi prison guard, “will you make it a priority?” I said, “Yes”. And I did it. And then, President
Trump said to me, “You should really get that
Nazi prison guard returned.” I’m like, “I’m on it.” I brought it up
in every meeting, I made it a priority. Had to educate them. They returned him. – Does Trump basically just say, do whatever you want until–
– No. (laughing) – Not fully that, but like, I sense what he does with
people is he gets people he kinda likes and trusts
and let them do their thing, and then–
– He– – He gets involved in
some way after that, or something like that.
– What I would say is, I’ll give you the
perfect example. He gave me, he called
one day and said, “We’re getting killed
on medical devices.” And I was like, “Oh, I don’t
know anything about it.” And he goes, “I know, but
you’ll figure it out.” (Dave laughing)
And I said, “I’m on it, I’ll report
back and tell you “what we’re getting killed on, “and what I think
the solution is.” And he’s like,
“Good, make it soon.” So suddenly, you
have a directive from the President of the
United States to figure it out. So what do I do? I immediately go
out and I meet with the medical device
companies in Germany, and then the ones providing
jobs in the United States, and then the US ones. Figure out what’s your problem. I figured out what
the problem was, or I should say, one of the
problems, a big problem, and then we tackle it and we try to deal with the whole FAA,
and US trade negotiator. And to be an
ambassador, I think, you have to be able
to know how to work the inner agency process
of the US government. You gotta be an expert
on the US government. Not an expert on
giving dinner parties. You have to be an expert
on how to maneuver within the US government,
to help companies. I help German companies
only if they have US jobs. I view my job as solely trying to create more economic
opportunity for Americans, more jobs, better paying jobs. And so that can be
done through Lufthansa, the great German airline, who
has 15,000 American employees. That can be done
through Siemens, that has 60,000
American employees. BMW in South Carolina. So I’m constantly trying
to help grow American jobs, but sometimes it’s
through German companies. – So I thought it’d be an
interesting way to end, which is that when
we met, so I sorta, we knew each other
about five years ago, just through Twitter, the way everyone knows
everybody these days. (Rick laughing)
But I was a lefty at the time, I mean, I
was a full-on progressive. I worked at “The Young Turks”, and I had you on my show
one time you came in, and you were the
scary conservative, and it was a very
different show than this, and we just did hot
topic kind of stuff. But it was very clear
that the other panelists didn’t like you, and we
disagreed on some stuff, and whatever, it
doesn’t even matter. – Who doesn’t like me?
– Yeah, well you were– – I’m so nice.
– I remember, it was specifically, it
was right before Christmas and we were talking
about how everybody’s going crazy at stores for
Black Friday and everything, and you were saying
how great it is, and people are out
there, and they’re– – Shopping.
– Shopping, and blah, blah, blah. And they were basically saying, oh, you capitalist
pig, and blah, blah. – Right, right.
– Anyway, it doesn’t even matter the specifics. But I mention all that
because I would assume that you must be pretty
freakin’ thrilled at the way the
world is tracking. That now it’s four
or five years later and you see someone like
me who was a former lefty, that, even though I
think we still have some minor political
disagreements, doesn’t even matter what it is, but that there really
is, like, this rich thing happening on the
conservative side right now. And for somebody that was
an out gay conservative way before really there
was anybody out there, you must be pretty happy
that it does feel like a pretty freakin’
wide tent right now. – I also feel pretty old–
– How was that for a question? I just lofted you
something there. – I also feel pretty old.
(Dave laughing) When I look at, like, being
at the 1992 convention, being friends with
Andrew Breitbart, when Andrew Breitbart
came to me and said, “CPAC is now allowing
gays to have a boot “at the log cabin.” And I was like, “Andrew,
it’s ridiculous.” And he’s like, “What do
you think if I boycott?” And I was like,
“You’ll be a hero.” And then he did, and then
he had this huge party and it just transformed. I mean, so much of what
Andrew Breitbart did, and this is not an
endorsement of everything that Breitbart.com does.
– Yeah, isn’t it so sad you have to say
that with almost everything these days, you have
to, like, qualify. – But Andrew, who helped
launch “The Huffington Post”, and I met him when he was
working for Ariana Huffington. And I guess the answer is
is that the fight and debate for making our country
better is something that I’m really
passionate about. And I’ve seen the utility
of the fight and the debate. As long as you do it
in a respectful way. I have to say one of
the most hurtful things when I went through
confirmation is how the left completely took two
or three of my tweets that were meant to be funny, and turned ’em into a sexist. I mean, I became
the sexist thing. And democratic senators
took to the floor and were like, he’s a sexist. They didn’t even know me. Matter of fact, some of
those democratic senators I’ve asked 11 times
to meet with me and they’ve refused
to meet with me. – Of course. Well, also, the whole
time during your, well, first off, they kept
delaying your confirmation, too, right?
– Yeah. – So they’re saying
Trump hates gay people. Trump’s got the openly
gay guy he’s trying to get confirmed as
Ambassador to Germany. – Yeah, Washington is a mess. I mean, it’s such a mess. And so all I’m saying
is is that I always feel like a thoughtful debate. Right? Tolerance, diversity, right? I can sit, I have so
many liberal friends. I can sit with my
liberal friends, have a good discussion. I sometimes learn from them. Oh, that’s interesting. They learn from me. This is what happened with,
I think, your journey. I have some of the same journey. I don’t have the same views as
I had eight, nine years ago. Everybody changes. If you’re listening
in the debate, you are absolutely going
to learn and change. – I can’t believe it took
us so long to do this. You had to go be the
Ambassador to Germany and bouncing all over the world. It was a pleasure, my friend. Next time, I’m wearing a
hoodie and you’re gonna wear a suit, how
does that sound? – Can I just say
that I think you have the best show on the internet? We do not have the ability to
talk about issues like this. Thank you for doing it. I know that it’s not
always easy, but it’s huge. It’s huge. And it’s so healthy. And for everybody that’s
listening to these debates, and learning, if you’re
in your car or whatever, I mean, it’s amazing. It’s amazing. We need more of this, not less. – Follow him on Twitter,
@RichardGrenell. If you’re looking
for more honest and thoughtful
conversations about politics instead of non-stop yelling, check out our politics playlist. And if you wanna
watch full interviews on a variety of topics, watch
our full episode playlist, all right over here. And to get notified
of all future videos, be sure to subscribe and
click the notification bell.

100 Comments on "Ambassador: Exposing UN Waste & Trump’s Pro Gay Policies | Richard Grenell | POLITICS | Rubin Report"


  1. Diplomats try to talk you into solving your own problems… the Pentagon walks into your house and solves the problem. Your choice?

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  2. Great interview, but I wish Ruben had pushed back on the claim that Assad was gassing people. It has been proven beyond any reasonable doubt that it was actually rebels who carried out the gas attacks, and even in the first place it would not have made any sense whatsoever for Assad to have done that. He was winning the war using conventional weapons, he knew that the only way the West would interfere in favor of the rebels was if he used chemical weapons. he had no reason to use them and every reason not to use them, whereas the rebels had every reason to use them and try to blame Assad.

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  3. Not buying this pro Trump stuff. He is evil, evil is evil period. Rubin goes on and on about the alt left but never criticizes Trmp or his cult, he is Hitler of this generation, this will come back to bite both these guys in the ass

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  4. Much love from germany, i really liked Richard Grenell as Ambassador. But the media is scary these days…………

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  5. Sorry, Mr. Ambassador. You may be right on a number of things but you are denial about your sexual orientation. If you believe in God, and His created order, you KNOW that men and women were created to be complimentary to each other. Christ will be the eventual judge, not me, but I will speak truth to a fellow brother in Christ. I do not doubt you on that.

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  6. I'm against thought police so as long as religious folks are willing to ignore their religion's violent doctrines through whatever excuses helps them sleep at night I'm willing to live and let live.

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  7. I have to say after getting over the "being gay helped me be a better christian" comment. This guy is a really smart man, hoping he cleans out the embedded intelligence Trump haters and as always it sounds like Trump choose wisely! Good Report Rubin.

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  8. Got to love hearing Grenell whinging about unqualified people being hired for jobs at the UN. Without a hint of irony either, the lack of awareness is strong in this one.

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  9. I love hearing these testimonies and how honest they are about Trump. As someone who thinks Trump is an amazing president but wish he would tweet less, I'm not a raging extremist – it's crazy to watch how to media paints him. But also how Never-Trumpers and Forever-Trumpers are so extreme in their views on Trump. It's also a weird phenomenon as compared to people how they viewed Obama.

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  10. I could support his position if the scriptures don't refer to "exchanging the natural use for a woman and instead, lust in their flesh for one another" as an abomination against God. Knowingly violating scripture then asking for His forgiveness day after day does not give you access to God in prayer. Tresspassing His word blocks access until you repent, ask forgiveness, then go forward. That's what it says.

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  11. Being a gay evangelical will really f–k up your head. Being a shill for Trumpy is a job filled with humiliation and disappointment.

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  12. This is the guy that the media is losing their minds over? His appointment to DNI would be universally praised if it was under any Democratic president. Great guy, great interview.

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  13. I wasn’t really familiar with him until I watched this. He seems like an extremely capable diplomat and one of the good guys in government

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  14. He seems really young for an important ambassador then I looked him up hes 53, looking good like he is in his thirties.

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  15. Congratulations Richard Grenell!!.
    May GOD protect you, President Trump and America..I feel comfortable that a DNI is an Evangelical Christian and an intelligent one😍😍💜💜..

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  16. Fantastic interview and insight into the Trump administration. Especially appreciated the comparison to how the Obama admin did things.

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  17. So let me get this straight, the dems don't want Richard to be the head of intel because he's not a progressive atheist gay guy but a religious ethical person who understands common sense and would represent our country with great respect and virtue? or just simple TDS?

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  18. The UN is a big pet peeve of mine, they push agendas that are anti American and scam climate change. Pls get us out of the UN. Ty.

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  19. You do realize that the crazies in the left are the ones stopping you right? People in the most conservative countries will consider you the same (conservative liberals) as the crazy progressives we have today. You guys need to split from those insane people asap if you want to have some progress.

    I heard Dave say that a split in the democratic party is inminent, the faster that happens the better for everyone.

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  20. Team and individual sport is where the competition is. Politics has it, but cheating is part of the play. This eliminates all the truth tellers and honorable people. What you have left are the politicians.

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  21. See this is how people half ass things and get it screwed up. Are the people interviewing/hiring looking at qualified minorities or are they (standard) just saying we need to see this number of blacks this number of Latinos etc. If they are being selective but fair, then alit of time and resources are being wasted on something they've sabotage d from the start. It's as easy to find the right candidates as just randomly pickinking minorities to fill a quotea.

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  22. Asad did not gas his own children! I've been familiar with Rich for years(via RedEye) and he seems like a great guy. But now i'm scared… If he buys into the White Helmet BS then he's the wrong guy for the job..

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  23. It's been debunked now – Assad HAD NOTHING TO DO WITH GASING PEOPLE – Other crap maybe – but that claim is FALSE

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  24. The U.N. was created right after WW2 for the sole purpose of giving the Land of Israel to the Jews in 1948.
    After that solid, greatest task was completed….it just went down hill because the progressists moved in.
    Globalization is their goal… won't work because Our Lord God Almighty won't allow remember the flood.
    Amen!

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  25. I am a Bible Student. How many Eunchus cleaved to Christ thru out the Bible? Many. And
    Many were instrumental in helping the Christians move forward.

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  26. With his experience and knowlege , his ability to see through the bullshit 
    and with Tumps support and guidance , Rich is going to a force in American history!

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  27. Trumpism – the society of the spectacle and the centrist dad;)
    can't you just become the "german" chancellor and can we create a holy land from north to south pole with a global citizenship?

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  28. The EU looks like the Nazi's won. Germany running it oil/gas from Russia knowing Russia could cut it off at anytime.

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  29. As a German I would like to use an alternative explanation for the hesitant intervention in Syria. Although it is also a question of our historical responsibility after the Second World War, there is reason to believe that the evidence of poison gas attacks by Assad may have been fabricated. This is evident from the OPCW report (2018) and theoretical considerations by Richard Lloyd (Tesla) and Theodore Postol (MIT) (2014). It also seemed like one of the previous initiatives for a system change in the Middle East. When one also recalls the proven false testimony of the Nayirah testimony (1990) and the fake evidence of Colin Powell on Saddam Hussein's weapons of mass destruction (2003), one must be sceptical about such accusations.

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  30. Pausing around the 29 minute mark. I usually listen to stuff like this while playing video games. I put this on to listen to during my 3rd playthrough of Ass Creed Black Flag.
    This time,I honestly can't divide my attention and let my ears do all the walking. This is a fascinating discussion. You two succeeded in engaging me as your audience, which I will tell myself was your goal. It's not the visuals (unremarkable), but the conversation that drew my comment.
    Now watch me be a hypocrite and capture another fort while listening.

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  31. The promotion of ANY sort of sexuality is not nessasary
    in the context of the seriousness of our times… Somehow taints your platform… But thankyou

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  32. It’s been two years since husband cheated. he has done everything he can to fix his mistake. I just can’t get over the fact some other girl was having sex with him while he was married to me. Two years and I still can’t stomach it. @redhackpro on instagram he was able to hack into my husband mobile phone, You can also send him a whatsapp messages +1 937-815-1491. he has changed. he has learned his lesson. What good is that now? All I see is a nasty slut who had a nasty girl on him with his penis in her.

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  33. Just want to echo this – Thank you for doing this show. It's the best free-flowing show anywhere right now.

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  34. Nobody:

    Dave: Your gay moustache has blown my cover.

    Everyone: 😶😐🤔😯😀😄😂😂

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  35. Not only is the UN a jobs program, it is heavily nepotistic. Those jobs almost entirely go to family, friends, and political allies of a given third world country's UN ambassador.

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  36. The UN has been out of control for more than 60 years: it's long past it's sell by date, and needs to die.

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  37. I get his pain, When i was younger it didn't matter what I did I was always told "I thought you were a christian" Then when I became ultra religious and wanted to become a hermit, I was laughed at. If someone questions your faith based upon your weaknesses or preference, promptly tell then to fck off.

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  38. If you don't spot at least 50 lies and inconsistencies in this interview, you are not really red-pilled.

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  39. So now it's coming out that this guy convinced the Ecuadorian embassy to give up Assange and allow the US to have Assange arrested. Considering that's a direct attack on the freedom of press, I wonder if Dave will address this ever in the future?

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  40. Trump's style? You mean phony hair color and pretentious furniture? Pretty much how he governs so obviously for the reflection back onto himself. He just has blinders on where the interests of Americans is concerned. Same with republicans in general. Did you get you couple hundred buck tax break to keep quiet like a good little cult?

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  41. I have oft wondered if the issue of evangelicals v. gay marriage was grossly exaggerated by the Left and their propagandist media. . Anyone else, including Dave Rubin & Richard Grenell wonder the same?

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  42. In the Netherlands we still make a lot of WWII jokes about the Germans like: "Hey, give my grandma her bike back!". But when you say this to a German, they really don't know what to say 😂

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  43. I like this guy, and its weird, cause he's gay, but not pushing it on anyone, he's just asking for people to be tolerant, he's not asking to change my mind, he just wants to be treated like a human being, if more gays were like him and even Rubin, then the gay thing wouldn't be an issue because its not the center of everything, he just happens to be gay it is not what defines him, and I think that is what bothers me about a lot of gays, that the central part of their being is being gay rather than just being a person….

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  44. Grenell just got promoted to top intel job. Right now, he's probably tripping out on the real space force, cloning, mockingbird, mk ultra, who killed jfk, who killed his buddy Andrew Breitbart, who knew about 911, all of it. He seems like a guy who can handle the truth. Trump again shows his judgement. Well done.

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  45. Great interview! Just wanted to share something interesting. Tonight I shared this video on FB with a comment to my mom to watch it. Oddly enough it is nowhere in my own feed, only can see if I go directly to my page. Hmm…

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  46. It made me very proud to hear from Richard “The UN doesn’t work if America isn’t leading it. UNICEF, etc. doesn’t work if America is not there”

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  47. I agree with this dude, Rubin has the most comforting place to discuss the most controversial political topics there are. It's the best thing for politics when it's so divided.

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  48. Dave Rubin you forgot to bring up the topic of trans with Richard Grenell. I would have loved to have heard his opinion on the topic.

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  49. Good, except it's very unlikely Assad gassed his own people for no reason, especially when he knew the whole world would get in his business if he did. 🤫

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  50. Grennel is a great choice for the DNI. He's tough, smart, and cares about our country. I appreciate his insight on the farce we call the UN.

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  51. All of these big global organizations are completely useless. Just look at the W.H.O’s handling of the Corona virus.

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